Perseverance: A Daily Choice in Troubled Times with Margaret J Wheatley, EdD

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Born from a Hopi Nation prophecy urging us to “let go of the shore” and enter the river of change, Wheatley reflects on why persevering through today's grief, exhaustion, and civilizational upheaval is a daily choice rather than a single act of courage. Drawing on Buddhism and other spiritual traditions, she distinguishes "dwelling mind" from analytic reasoning, describes how corporations manufacture guilt through greenwashing, and reframes laziness as busyness and avoidance of presence. She speaks movingly about bearing witness to suffering we cannot fix, the sacredness in small moments like a snail crossing a sidewalk, and groundedness as an unshakable faith when we are feeling exhausted and in despair. The conversation closes with Vaclav Havel's definition of hope, not certainty of outcome, but conviction that the work is worth doing. Throughout, she offers companionship, not formulas, for staying awake, and being generous and connected amid profound uncertainty and transformation. (hosted by Justine Willis Toms)

Bio

Margaret J Wheatley, EdD is an internationally acclaimed writer, speaker, and teacher.  She began caring about the world's peoples in 1966 as a Peace Corps volunteer in postwar Korea. She is cofounder and President Emerita of The Berkana Institute, a charitable foundation that works with people around the world to strengthen their communities using the wisdom and wealth already present in their people, traditions, and environment. She is a guide in leading people back to understanding who we are as humans, being able to create the conditions for our basic qualities of generosity, contribution, community, and love. She is a grand contributor in creating an Island of Sanity in the midst of wildly disruptive seas. 

Margaret J Wheatley's books include:

• Leadership and the New Science  (Berrett-Kohler 1998)
• Perseverance: A Companion for the Journey (revised)  (Berrett-Kohler 2026)
• Turning To One Another: Simple Conversations to Restore Hope in the Future (Berrett-Kohler 2009)
• So Far from Home: Lost and Found In Our Brave New World (Barrett-Kohler 2012)
• Who Do We Choose To Be: Facing Reality, Claiming Leadership, Restoring Sanity (Berrett-Kohler 2017)
• Restoring Sanity: Practices to Awaken Generosity, Creativity & Kindness in Ourselves and Our Organizations (Berrett Kohler 2024)
• Opening to the World As It Is: Poems of Experience (Berkana Publications 2024)

To learn more about the work of Margaret Wheatley go to www.margaretwheatley.com.

Topics explored in this dialogue include:

·      

• Perseverance as a daily spiritual practice, not a one-time act
• The Hopi Nation river prophecy of letting go of the shore
• Dwelling mind versus analytic mind in times of chaos
• Corporate greenwashing and manufactured guilt over climate change
• Reframing laziness as busyness, distraction, and avoidance
• Bearing witness to suffering we cannot fix
• Groundedness and faith as a lived experience
• Hope as commitment to the work, not certainty of outcome

Host: Justine Willis Toms    Interview Date: 9/4/2026   Program Number:  3873

Music Playlist

Album: Dorothea Lange - Grab a Hunk of Lightning (original Soundtrack)
Artists: Jami Sieber & Evan Schiller
Track 29 Manzanar